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Advocacy & DVA Explained 2

S2: Episode 5:
This Man Is Obsessed With Numbers!

Season 2 of Axon’s Unleashed continues…

Where does a lifetime obsession with numbers lead you? Our special guest, Jace Cosgrove, owner and founder of ‘Your Wealth Corporation’ stopped by to discuss his lengthy career in finance and passion for wealth creation for his clients.

Another perfectly aligned member of the greater Axon Group, Jace has been serving the Axon community since our inception. How was this trust formed? There is no-one that knows your numbers better!

Don’t miss out.

Listen to Axons Unleashed:

TRANSCRIPT:
Intro Voice:
Axons Unleashed.

Robbie:
Good day, everyone. My name's Robbie. I'm joined here with Tamara. I've got Dan. We got another special guest with us today, the amazing Jace Cosgrove from Your Wealth Corporation. Good morning, everybody.

Tamara:
Hello, good morning.

Dan:
Hey, guys. I noticed that IT always needed to flash down. Just check the name on your shirt. Yes, it's absolutely Your Wealth Corporation.

IT:
I was checking that he had it on.

Robbie:
Okay, to be fair like these Polo shirts that we wear, you got the idea. Why not just fucking wear a Polo shirt everyday? Make it easy. It's a uniform.

Dan:
Right.

Tamara:
Actually we had the boys dress up just, maybe three days ago. I think it was Adam and Damo were standing there, and they go, "Thank God we have a uniform because it just saves us from choosing what we wear every day." We're like, "We're so grateful for not choosing anything."

Robbie:
It's the very first thing we did.

Tamara:
It's hard enough to get you guys to wear.

Dan:
Shoes.

Tamara:
Well yeah, Dan, shoes. Shoes for Dan. Sport shirt for Dane. I'm like Jesus Christ.

Robbie:
We're down here on the Goldie and I mean you're looking at the beach and the water and the boats. You're like, "Do you really want to be wearing shoes?"

Dan:
This is Gulf Coast Corporate, right?

Robbie:
Exactly. [crosstalk 00:01:18]

Tamara:
Shoes are required though.

Dan:
Yes, you need shoes.

Robbie:
No we are actually completely off script here, but IT, we did a little special recording last week where we actually spoke in depth and Tamara actually interviewed us in depth about a certain little endeavor that you put us onto, mate. The old 75 Hard.

IT:
Yeah, good.

Dan:
I told the story, everyone.

Robbie:
Yeah, absolutely so I mean one of those big things that I suppose we have to say thank you first up mate is for putting us onto that and I supposed putting the challenge out there for some people to sort of take that next level and to be able to go and put themselves through that challenge over a certain period of time. But yeah, the insights you actually provided everyone as they were going through there is a 75 Hard veteran, let's call it. Done it once or twice before yourself in varying stages. You certainly had some of those little glimpses of information that you were able to pass onto people as well.

IT:
Yeah, mate. No look, it was great. I mean I did that a couple of years ago and Robbie asked me about it. When he said I'm going to do it. I said, mate, I'm a better person for having done it. Because you start to understand your ability. You can understand you're capable of so much more. We've had a saying as hard as it is and the effect that is has on your loved ones because it annoys them, you are better for it for everything that you do. It makes them better for it.

Tamara:
We were seeing such dramatic changes. The first time you really got sucked into 75 Hard, I remember you coming in for a meeting and we hadn't seen you for probably a month.

IT:
75 days.

Tamara:
No, probably like a month or so or maybe a big longer and just your whole face changed. The shape of your face had changed. We were seeing such huge physical changes from you let alone what was going on mentally and all the rest of it. That, that this challenge brings, but that was the first time we like what are you doing? Tell us about this. That was the first time that you let us into what that was.

IT:
In on the secret. It's funny. I don't really weight myself. If I'm going to look at myself and see ow I feel I don't have to weight myself to see how I feel. Anyway, the night before I started I'm like I'm going to weigh myself to see how much with I lose. I was 99.9 kilos. I don't think I've ever been 100. I've never had to raise the bat. But I reckon another Mars bar that night would have got rid of that. I dropped about 13 kilos in that first one. I've stayed at that same weight since then, you know. So that's the benefit of it.

Robbie:
Phenomenal.

Dan:
I think it's really telling. One of the key things you spoke about there is you can see the physical changes, but it's making you a better individual from a fully rounded perspective.

Robbie:
100%.

Dan:
I think that's one of the themes that probably going to really go through in this podcast today is talking about things from a holistic perspective. Not just focusing on one individual element but to bring everything together as well in a full holistic approach.

Tamara:
What a segue.

Robbie:
I like that, mate.

Dan:
That's me. I'm done.

Robbie:
So for those who don't know we've got our commander properly method. So from a military perspective there's purpose, method and end state when you get given a set of orders. The purpose is why you're doing it. The method is how you're going to do it and of course the ends state is what you need to achieve at the end. So, the very nucleus of our commander properly method is all about the strategy and the planning. It quickly encapsulates, I should say, what's going on from a finance perspective, but what's also going on from a tax and holistic financial planning and wealth management modeling sort of perspective.

Robbie:
So, you're absolutely central to the way that, you know, we talk to all of our clients. As we all know, when you're buying an investment property, it has two forms of guaranteed income; a rent return and and a tax return. So clearly, there's tax implications that need to be taken into consideration. But as your business has evolved, you've now got, you know, other ways that you're helping people from that overall financial planning and wealth model management. I really want to dive into that more today.

Robbie:
You're no stranger to Axon. You've now been on two of our live Q&As.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yes.

Robbie:
Which is good and the feedback, Tammy and Dan, we've got from everybody is, "Geez, that Jace, he's a bloody awesome guy to talk to." Then literally dozens of clients have since spoken to you going, "So glad I went to go and see him. He got way more tax back for me. He was a lot cheaper than my other accountant was and/or we just feel so much better about our financial future and we know we're going to be better off than what we thought we could actually be.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah.

Tamara:
And I know that it's a unique situation because you're not just an accountant. YOu're also a financial planner.

Jace Cosgrove:
Financial advisor, yeah.

Tamara:
Financial advisor, sorry. So many different terms here. I guess that means you're not just looking at them in this for taxation for your end of financial year thing, but you're on the journey with people. You're taking them through that. You're forward planning. You're having a look what their future goals are. You're looking forward for, retirement and beyond and all those things that it's not just you're able to do that because you're not just an accountant.

Jace Cosgrove:
Exactly, I think Dan, you said it before, the holistic or maybe you said it Robbie, the holistic approach. The way I look at accounting is that it's probably a bit backwards. Yes, you plan things for the future, but when we're doing the accounting, we're doing individual tax returns for a lot of Axon clients and it's based on what happened last year. Your income was this. Your rental income was this. All of your expenses and the like generated the tax refund which is one of your forms of income.

Jace Cosgrove:
The financial planning side of that is more future planning. So we've developed this approach which we'll talk more about called Your Wealth Your Way and we say to people, "How much do you want to live off when you retire? How much income do you need to generate?" So how much do you want to live off? How much wealth do need to generate? And are you on track? There are three simple questions but nobody knows the answer. When they hear the question, they're like, "Wow, I really should know the answer." The questions as silly as they are, they don't even relate to some people because I was talking to some of your guys last night that are in their 20s. I say, "How much do you want to live off when you retire?" They're like, "That's 40 years away."

Robbie:
No one's thinking about that at that point in time, right?

Tamara:
I know that even when Robbie and I did the Your Wealth Your Way questionnaire I was like, well I don't know how much we need to retire. It was fun to ask. Even though we live in this world of understanding money a lot better than most, we're putting things investments and we're doing different strategies to look after our future selves, but we had no idea what do we actually need to retire. How are we still going to live a comfortable life and when is it going to run out? People are living longer these days.

Robbie:
If I only need this much to live off and I can be comfortable, can I drag my retirement forward four or five or six years?

Jace Cosgrove:
Oh, now we're talking, last nights' guys. They wanted to retire on $120,000 when they were 60 years old. Our model suggest they're going to retire on $200,000 when they get to 60 years old. The planning they were doing is building up assets outside of super, outside of property so that they can access liquid money into their 50s because if they want to live on $120,000, they might be able to retire early to mid 50s, not wait until 60 to get to 200.

Tamara:
I guess that's not about when you have to retire, but being able to choose when you retire. Robbie's not allowed to retire because-

Jace Cosgrove:
As if he'd want to.

Tamara:
... he'd drive me bloody crazy, but also he doesn't want to. He loves what he does. He's living his passion every day. But that's giving him the choice to do that. You talk to people that are a tradey and the retirement age is what, 70? Can you imagine being a bricklayer at 70? I mean that's awful.

Jace Cosgrove:
You have no other choice.

Tamara:
That's because they haven't set themselves up or the only option is to live on the pension. Who knows what's going to happen with that?

Robbie:
Absolutely, I mean it's one of those things that you spoke about, the young 20-year-olds and the fact that they're into their numbers early. Like you must have been into numbers really early as well for you to like actually stream down this line that is accounting and financial advisory.

Jace Cosgrove:
Mate, I love numbers. [crosstalk 00:09:45]

Robbie:
His eyes lit up when I just said numbers.

Jace Cosgrove:
Let me tell you a couple stories about numbers, right? One time we went on a holiday to Hawaii. It might have been the same time you guys went.

Robbie:
It was.

Tamara:
Oh, we ran into each other.

Jace Cosgrove:
Anyway, I jump in the higher car and the first thing I noticed is the mileage on the car is 12345, and I'm like, "Kids, check it out. This is going to be good, the numbers straight away."

Tamara:
Nerding out.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, but that stuff is the best part of my day.

Tamara:
I've seen you post your stories of your own car.

Jace Cosgrove:
The other day I had one of my own car which I had to do the same case. I think I had 11,111. So I had to quickly get to the highway so I could do 111 case and take the photos of all the ones. I just love my numbers.

Robbie:
You mean your passenger was taking the photos.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, my passenger, one of the kids out of the backseat. From an early age, mate, I remember in grade one, we would set this challenge. If something was exciting what would you want to do? Kids were like I want to be able to see fairies or whatever they wanted to do. I'm like, "I want to be able to get into a time machine so I can go back to [inaudible 00:10:47] and get the Lotto numbers." I've always had a thing about numbers and money. And so, I don't hold any grudges. That's what I'm about.

Robbie:
So your boyfriend in the bush grew upon Towamba?

Jace Cosgrove:
[crosstalk 00:11:01] Yeah.

Robbie:
Live down here in the Gold Coast now with Nat and a couple of beautiful kids.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, Nat, three kids, mate, we live out in Talabudra.

Robbie:
Beautiful.

Jace Cosgrove:
We're in the middle of nowhere and we're in the middle over everything all at the same time.

Tamara:
Yeah.

Jace Cosgrove:
It's great.

Robbie:
Tell us the story of how you actually got down off the range. Like what did the man from Towamba do to find his way down onto the beaches?

Jace Cosgrove:
Oh, mate, all right.

Robbie:
I don't even know what the story is, but I thought. [crosstalk 00:11:25]

Jace Cosgrove:
Let me tell you. Let me go through a couple of points, right? My mum, she would always bring us down the coast. She used to have this one saying. "Have cow, will travel." So maybe ever second weekend, we would jump in the car and drive down the Gold Coast. We'd spend two weeks in September down in the Gold Coast on holidays and two weeks at Christmastime. I'd just always, "Got to get me to the Gold Coast. I want to get to the Gold Coast."

Jace Cosgrove:
So one day I'm 21, 22 years old and I'm laying in bed watching early morning TV and this ad comes on about wealth creation. At this time, I'm working as an accountant in problem one of the biggest accounting firms in Towamba. They had six partners and 100 stay.

Robbie:
I thought your were going to say six people. That's half of [inaudible 00:12:01].

Jace Cosgrove:
That sounds like Towamba. Six partners, 100 staff anyway, I wasn't really feeling it about being an accountant. I didn't know what I wanted to do but anyway. So I see this guy that says wealth creation ad on TV. I'm like, all right. I'm going to go along. I want to see what this is about. I go along and there's this guy talking about shares and property and all this sort of thing and he's got a great personality and this real presence about him. I'm there and I'm in my young 20s. I drag Natalie along and everyone else in their 60s. So there's an age gap.

Jace Cosgrove:
I went up to him during the break because he talked about his boat. I can talk to him about his boat. I had a jet ski. I grew up water skiing. I love boats. I go, "Mate, I want to do what you do and I need to share your lunch. You can kick my butt in the right direction." He's like, "No worries, mate. I'm coming back from another presentation next week. Come back and then we'll chat about it."

Jace Cosgrove:
We chatted about it again and he goes, "Here's my card. If you do want to have a chat, give me a call." We jump on the back of his boat. He's got this 60 foot Riviera. I'm like, "Now, I'm definitely doing this." I ring him the next day. I'm like, "Hey Rick, you mentioned lat night." He goes, "I didn't know how serious you are." I said, "Mate, I'm serious." He offered me a position. He had this business in Brisbane which was holistic financial planning. There was a property guy there. There was a shares guy there. There was an accountant there. This is early 2000. I see self-managed super being a growing industry. "That's what you told me you like about your job. Why don't you come down to Brisbane and set up your own business?" I was hoping he was going to give me a job so I could be influenced by him. He offered me a business.

Jace Cosgrove:
He goes, "All these businesses in here, I own half of. You own half of. We've got this collection." That got me down to Brisbane. That business got sold to public company. Basically said it was paradise. So as soon as that happened I'm like, right. I'm taking this chance to get myself based out of the head office. That was all well and good. Sounds like a great story.

Jace Cosgrove:
In 2008, let me finish the story. So, Natalie and I we go and buy our first home, right? On the 4th of July, 2008, we move into the first home. Natalie does a pregnancy test. She comes out. She goes, "Jace, I just found out we're pregnant with our second child." I'm like, "Wow, this is the bloody first thing that happened in the new toilet of the new home." We find out she's pregnant. I get a phone call later that day from the boys at work, going "Jace don't come back to work Monday." This is Friday. I'm like, "What?" They go, "We just had liquidators in. The place is being shut down." I'm like, "No, hang on. You guys are kidding, right?" They go, "Mate."

Jace Cosgrove:
I knew it was bad because the share price was just going down, down. I'm like, "You serious?" They go, "Mate," all the staff were pulled in together. Basically said, "Any entitlements you've got will be met, but don't come back Monday." I turn around and look at Nat and she's putting cups away in the kitchen. Never been happier. Our first home, little three-bedroom house in Burly.

Tamara:
Still, with the pregnancy test on the table.

Jace Cosgrove:
She's got her mum there. They're all doing this. I'm just like, how do I tell her this?

Tamara:
How do you burst this bubble?

Jace Cosgrove:
So that was three big things on the 4th of July, 2008. Maybe for another day that story ended pretty well. That's what got me to the Gold Coast, mate.

Robbie:
Shit, I'm glad you asked.

Tamara:
Sometimes it is those times that you think it's pretty shitty at the time, but then you look back at those things that happened and you go, "Wow, I'm glad that happened."

Jace Cosgrove:
Do you know what? I've never shared the next part.

Dan:
Let's do it.

Robbie:
Let's go.

Tamara:
Are we going now?

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, we're going to have to. Enough time is passed. I turned to Nat. I said, "Nat this is what's just happened. Don't worry about it. I'll fix it. I've got some ideas. We're good." I didn't have any ideas. I went in the car. I drive [inaudible 00:15:39]. All my ridge mates, "I need a job. Do you have anything? I can start it Monday." None of them did. I went to work Monday. Didn't know if the doors were going to be locked like they said. There's one guy there, one remaining director. I said, "Mate, I don't know what to do." I had put that in my [inaudible 00:15:56] super fund business and it got sold. I had a million dollars worth of shares in this company which just gone, that weekend. Nothing left.

Jace Cosgrove:
So I thought I was king of the world at 28. I'm doing really well. Got my house. Got my shares. Got the kids, wife, happy days. So I go to work and this guy's there. I'm working as a stock broker. This is in the middle of the financial crisis. The shares are worth nothing. The strategies that we used don't work. We don't want to sell shares in this downward spiral in the market. I'm like, "Mate, what am I going to do?" He goes, "Mate, just take all those clients back." I'm like, "I can't take all the clients back. They were sold into the public company." He goes, "Well those clients are going to be just going out and finding their own accountants now."

Robbie:
They're going to need someone.

Jace Cosgrove:
They're not going to be sold. This is going to take a long time. This is going to filter off into nothing. Whilst we're having this chat, this courier knocks on the door and says, "Mate I've got all these boxes. What do you want done with them?" This other guy goes, "Put them in his car." I'm like, "What are the boxes?" He goes that's all the super funds that have just come back from files. I've driven home. I had a Jeep at that time. I literally could not have fit another piece of paper. I filled it up. Backseat's down. Front seats are covered in boxes. I drive home to Nat. I said, "Nat, I need you to leave. I need you to go to Towamba to your mum's house for two weeks. I'm going to get on the phone."

Jace Cosgrove:
I jumped on the phone from 8:00 a.m. until about 10:00 at night. I rang every single client that I'd had that got sold into this other company that had been with this other guy for a year. They were all like, "Thank God, you're back." Luckily that other guy was a jerk and I was a good guy.

Robbie:
We'll talk about that again in a minute.

Jace Cosgrove:
They're like, "Thank God, you're back." What I said to people. I just want to charge a monthly fee. I had an amount of money that I wanted to earn. In my mind, I'd like to earn $10,000 a month, 120 grand a year. I can work from home doing this. Support the kids. This is going to be great. I got that beautiful. The timing, I started charging clients monthly in July for the year ahead. We also had to do the last year's work. The end of the [inaudible 00:17:56] had just ticked over. None of those clients had been charged. None of those clients had done anything.

Jace Cosgrove:
I all of a sudden, smashing out this work and I'm getting 10 grand a month coming in as a monthly fee. I'm doing all the work monthly for these guys. Then I'm getting the 1200 to 1500 to 2 grand. All of a sudden I've gone from the day that the whole bad news happened. I ring up the real estate agent and said, "Mate, you said there was a couple other people. I might need you to sell this house for me." Literally the day we moved in. I range him back and said I might need you to resell my house. He goes, "There was no other people, mate. I just made that shit up." I'd love to punch you in the head right now.

Robbie:
Yeah, sounds like a real estate agent.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, anyway, so this is July. In September, I've got $76,000 in the bank. My September income was $46,000.

Robbie:
Boom.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah. Off we went.

Tamara:
That is a true example of you didn't sit there and wallow in your shit. You just...

Jace Cosgrove:
Had to get it done.

Tamara:
This is a shit situation. What am I going to do next?

Robbie:
In the military, you call that, Dan?

Dan:
What do you do now platoon commander?

Robbie:
Was that baseline or the start of Your Wealth Corporation?

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, mate, that business we called Jana Professional Services. I'm a boring accountant, no imagination. J-A-N-A. J-A Jace, N-A, Natalie, Jana Professional Services which then become Your Wealth Corporation, 2010, 2011 something like that.

Robbie:
Wow, what an interesting story. I had no idea about how you actually got down off the hill or any of that stuff. It's just phenomenal to know where I suppose Your Wealth Corporation has actually come from and how it's been created out of the ashes effectively.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, mate. Me looking at Natalie putting cups away. I'm about to break her heart.

Robbie:
I can only just imagine the brave face that you had to put on where you're like, "Don't worry, honey. I've got a plan. I know how to fix this."

Jace Cosgrove:
And she bought it too for a day. The next day she goes, "You haven't got a plan, have you?" I'm like, "No, I don't have a plan. I don't have any plans, but we'll be all right. Everything always works out."

Robbie:
You've got that grit.

Tamara:
That's a [inaudible 00:20:05] situation.

Robbie:
You've got that character. You're like, "I don't have a plan, but I'm not going to fucking fail either."

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, exactly, mate.

Robbie:
We went through all that in the first episode of season one. Been there. Done that.

Tamara:
I think even COVID like you talk about people that took the risk and took the opportunities that were presented and they were like I'm not going to let this fucking let this take me down.

Jace Cosgrove:
It's all about attitude. The worst time for me in the world is when the financial markets are flying because everybody thinks, hey, this is great. I can do it all myself.

Dan:
Everyone's a super start then.

Jace Cosgrove:
Exactly, mate. People always go, when it goes to shit, they're like, "Oh, business must be bad." I'm like, "Mate there's 20 something million people in this country. I can't help all of them." There's enough people out there for me to help. When business is bad, people are actually taking notice and happy to be directed.

Robbie:
Absolutely.

Jace Cosgrove:
So fast forward a couple of years, I'm working as a property consultant and/or venture general manager of another property investment firm. That's how we crossed paths back in the day, wasn't it?

Robbie:
That's it, yeah, mate.

Jace Cosgrove:
What was that, 2013, '14, '15?

Robbie:
Pretty close. I would say that would be the number.

Jace Cosgrove:
That was a good one. We all got on pretty much straight away.

Robbie:
Yeah, I mean I think the second time I met you I had dinner at your kitchen table with Tammy. Then we went back and did a webinar.

Jace Cosgrove:
That's it.

Dan:
There you go. I have to say my favorite question normally to ask is what was your first impression of Robbie Turner?

Robbie:
As they say, good friends stab you in the front. So go your hardest.

Jace Cosgrove:
I can't really recall a first impression. I remember that business every time we used to go there. There would be a dozen more people. Wow, these guys are really going. This is something I said to you the other day. So I'm not even going to answer first impressions. I'm going to mention current impressions. You guys inspire the hell out of me. What you're doing, you've built a world class team. You deliver a world class service. You inspire me to be better.

Jace Cosgrove:
That's why I say I'm a better person for having you guys in my life. I don't care about first impressions. I care about the whole thing about the five people that you have closest to you is who you're going to be because of the impression and the influence they provide upon you.

Robbie:
Absolutely, and you pick up on all of their traits as well. That's what people say.

Tamara:
That is so true. We employ high performance teams and we use high performance suppliers. You're so right. The people you surround yourself, if you're not around high performers, you soon realize you're not around high performers.

Jace Cosgrove:
100%.

Robbie:
From our perspective when I was working with other firm, there was another large CEO and Ops manager, [inaudible 00:22:37] sort of thing from a large financial planning and accountant firm in Brisbane came to our office. We started having vivid chat with him. The CEO of the other business is like all right. He's going to be the new accountant. We're going to refer our clients to. I'm like, "Fuck, what about, Jace?" Anyway, I'm like yes, sir. No, sir, no drums. If you want to change the direction of the business then I'm working in your business and I'll fall in behind you, loyalty and away we go.

Robbie:
So I had to ring you. I'm like, "Hey mate, by the way, all of the clients now that we're using, they're going to be going to another firm."

Tamara:
Is this another break up story?

Robbie:
Yeah, it's about to be another story, yeah. I guess it was one of those things where I had to say, "Look, if the business is now using the other firm, then I've got to do that myself." From a personal perspective, I had to ring up and go, "I'm now going to switch across this new accountancy firm because if I'm now one of the lead coaches in that property firm, I'll be like, "Hey, [crosstalk 00:23:34] now. Go speak to my client, these guys over here. Go speak to my accountant, my financial planner." Yeah, it was almost like I had to sack you there and go, "Look, for the best intentions and the best reasons." Fast forward a couple of years, where now circumstances change. We no longer kept using them anymore. I had to ring you up and go, "Hey, buddy. Are we still good?"

Tamara:
It sounds a lot like episode four of season one when you sacked me and begged me back.

Robbie:
Yeah.

Tamara:
Now, so that was number two. Who's three?

Robbie:
Dan's like...

Dan:
I haven't been sacked yet.

Jace Cosgrove:
At least you know you might get a phone call about you, mate.

Dan:
Exactly.

Robbie:
I just know the power of if you are using an amazing supplier and you've shifted through everyone else in the business, it just makes a no-brainer. It's a concept we have in the business, there's skin in the game. Deb is my mortgage broker. You are my accountant. Shea and the rans and crew do all of our high level legal stuff. In fact, we bought our own home through them as well. We use the same builders. We use the same property managers. We use all their new, other people, ladies and gents that you will be further introduced to as season two continues to grow. Me, as the owner of this firm, I use every single one of those people.

Robbie:
It just made sense that I did that. Right now that we've grown Axon and you've been here from the very start of it really is that every single one of my clients come to you now. I cannot foresee an event that is going to change that.

Tamara:
As we've said before, our reputation is on the line for whoever we refer to. If we're using them and we're getting the best experience. That's also what we expect for our clients. We don't expect any different treatment and we expect, well, we expect great treatment. We expect that for our clients as well.

Jace Cosgrove:
I can tell you from experience, 100% of the time, if I've referred a client to an outside party that's fucked them over, not only do they get the shits with them, they leave me, 100% of the time.

Robbie:
Of course they do.

Jace Cosgrove:
It's so important that inner circle that you keep that also they start to drop the ball.

Robbie:
You got to have each other's back 100% from that perspective as well. So that's good. I suppose one of the key things that I really love about your corporation model is when I get my tax return done, it's not just about getting last year's tax return done for me. It's about having that next discussion of okay, that was good for last year. Now what next for the year head? You need to start planning that. If you ring Jace up and you're like, "Hey, Jace. I'd like to have a chat about how I maximize my tax divergence activities over this financial year and it's May of that year, guess what?" You've already lost 10 months of the year, right?

Robbie:
One of the things that I think is the real secret sauce that you bring, Jace, is the ability not just to talk about the past and your finances but now how to actually make that work over the next 12, two years, everything like that.

Jace Cosgrove:
Right, it's funny that you bring this up. We haven't even chatted about this, right? I'm all about continually improving the service that we offer. For all of our individual returns this year, we're going to provide them with a report like over and above at no extra cost, but over and above their return. It's going to have a whole bunch of factors in there. For example, through the ATO portal you can see so much information. You can see how much someone's got in super. We give the report and say this is how much you've got in super. The average person your age has this much. This is your income. If you continue to earn this much income until you're say, 65, that's $5 million or whatever that it is. That's a significant asset that you need to ensure.

Jace Cosgrove:
We have this process within the Your Wealth Your Way model is that we allocate some of your money towards the reduction of wealth create. It's the pay yourself first principle, just [inaudible 00:27:25].

Robbie:
Yeah, exactly.

Jace Cosgrove:
10%. If you were able to allocate 10% of your income to wealth creation process, and that's invested for a period of time, this is how much. To give people an understanding, right, and I don't want to lead into something we're not about to chat about to chat about. I talk about time. I say to people time is your biggest asset. My whole point in doing this is to give people an understanding of what is possible within the time that they've got. The problem with time, I say time's an asset. You guys talk about assets accumulating in value. We want to buy property because we want it to increase by double or triple or whatever the timeframe is.

Jace Cosgrove:
Time depletes in value. It has a depreciating value. If you didn't utilize last year or the year before last for everything that it has to offer, you've now got less time.

Robbie:
Yeah, and you don't get that time back.

Jace Cosgrove:
You can't get the time back.

Robbie:
You can't make it up over [inaudible 00:28:18].

Jace Cosgrove:
It's your biggest asset.

Dan:
Where's that time machine you spoke about?

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, exactly, mate. Never happened. See this is the thing. I what talking about when I was seven years old.

Robbie:
I reckon if you went out there and you spoke to like some of the richest people in the world, right and the biggest wealth creators in the world, I reckon almost all of them would say the one thing that I wish I had more of with the ability to go back in time. Even though they've been super successful, I reckon, they'd change something.

Jace Cosgrove:
Because they know more now, mate.

Robbie:
Exactly.

Jace Cosgrove:
I want to go back.

Tamara:
You don't know what you don't know.

Robbie:
I literally had this same conversation. Just some lovely clients I had a discovery call with last night. They're like, "Oh, we're both 22. We just want to buy our own home." I'm like fuck. I'm 48 and I'm just building my own home now. But I didn't even start doing property until I was 31. Sure and I bought shit property when I first started because I didn't have a coach. I didn't have a mentor. I didn't have a plan. I didn't have all the things you are now going to get.

Tamara:
You're a little big ignorant and arrogant at the time. You knew everything.

Dan:
Did you even know him then, Tammy?

Robbie:
No, you didn't, but I was almost pleading with them. I'm like, "I'm so fucking happy for you, that you are 22 years old. You guys have got 90 grand in the bank. Double income, no kids and you want to go and build a portfolio based off what you were taught by us. I said, "You have no fucking idea how well off you are going to be by the time you get to my age." You can build a fucking mansion if you want. They're like, "Oh, that sounds good." I 25 years older than you. I was once 22 as well.

Dan:
Yeah, I'm glad you didn't know me back then, mate.

Robbie:
Yeah, so it was really good. We talked to all of our clients. I fucking get goosebumps now talking about it. That the power of time is so powerful and you show the demographic perspective, don't you?

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, but this is my whole point to say how much do you want to live off when you retire. There's no fucking relevance to you when you're 22 years old. The point is it's 28 years away. Let's use the 28 years. The whole point about this is the benefit of compounding. If you do it for the full 28, that's great. If you start in year two, you don't miss out on year one. You miss out on year 28. If you had $2 million at year 28 and you were always going up, I'll say 10% because it's a round number, it goes from $2 million to $2,200,0000. That's $200,000. If that was involving you putting $1,000 a month a way, you don't miss out on the $12,000. You miss out on $200,000. That's the benefit of the time.

Robbie:
That should be a real light bulb moment for some people, because it's not about what you miss out on the last year. It's what you miss out by not having the extra year back in.

Tamara:
Your future self.

Jace Cosgrove:
Your future self, you do the example of a one cent piece double for 30 days. It goes from 1 to 4 to 5 to $10 million. You don't miss out on one to two cents by starting a day later, you miss out on $5 to $10 million by starting one day later.

Robbie:
Love this. All of us have just gone... If you guys are listening and watching this, just please and you say it so very well all the time, Dan, we don't care what you do. Tam and I got a self-managed super fund. We've got shares inside that super fund. We've got a property portfolio. We've got our own home. We've got a fair smattering of assets. We've dabbled in all that different stuff. I'm not saying you need to follow that same direction, but just fucking do something. If you've just got money sitting in the bank and you're just in the grind or you're just in the bloody spinny wheel of life, the rat race as Robert [inaudible 00:31:45] talks about it. Just get out of that as much as you possibly can and put a plan in place.

Jace Cosgrove:
Mate, let me tell you how to do something, all right?

Robbie:
I would love you to.

Jace Cosgrove:
This is your segue. This is the Your Wealth Your Way process. So how much do you want to live with? Or how much do you need? Are you on track? We say time is your biggest asset, but the problem with time is it has a diminishing value. How do you utilize the value of time? From our point of view, we keep it simple. There's two different angles you need to take. One, the ordinary done consistently produces extraordinary results. Getting control of your super. Make sure it's invested properly. Make sure your debt's structured properly. Make sure you're utilizing all of the strategies. There's lots of gold in the strategies. Don't spend all of your money. Be appropriately insured, right? That's just the ordinary done consistently. Just all the little right things for all of the time.

Jace Cosgrove:
The other side of it is we want you to be an active participant in your financial life. So, we want to understand what the end game looks like that ticks your boxes. So if you want to live off $120,000 a year, what's it going to take? Once we know what the end game looks like, we know the actions that you need to take? Now you set a plan to build those actions. We build those actions around habits, automation discipline, consistency and intent. The whole point about what I do is I want to make sure that people are better off for knowing me. The way that we do that is to increase the trajectory that we're on.

Jace Cosgrove:
We can say to you based on what you're doing, you're heading out here. We've now made some changes and you're heading this way. [crosstalk 00:33:13].

Robbie:
Just went up over his head.

Jace Cosgrove:
Sorry guys. I went on TV. We go from 9:00 to 10:00 to 9:00 to 11:00, so increase that trajectory. That's the benefit. The further out you go the bigger it is because that's the time.

Robbie:
Divergent lines.

Dan:
Quite often people [crosstalk 00:33:36].

Tamara:
I absolutely love when we're interviewing people. You can see just from the way you are that you live your passion. You are loving what you do. You are so bloody passionate about helping people and helping their future self, their financials, getting them on the right track to live their best, future life.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, I mean look. I always say to people. You've only just met me. I can say anything, but once you get to know me, you do know what I'm about. There's that much abundance in this world. I want everyone to win. Everyone can win. You know what I mean? I don't need to steal something from Dan or Robbie to benefit me. We can all have it all.

Robbie:
As Gary [inaudible 00:34:21] says if you want to build the biggest building in town, you got without choices. You can tear everyone else's building down or build the biggest building in town. We want everyone to win.

Tamara:
That's so true. We even talk about that about our competitors, our people doing the same thing. We love catching up with people like that and sharing knowledge. There is so much. As you said, there's so many people there. There's so many people that you can help. Not everyone is going to be attracted to Robbie or Dan or Dane. There's different people that are going to be connected to other business models, other people. That's totally fine because there's so many people to go around. The same with you. You're living this life where you're just going to help the people that want to be helped.

Robbie:
Yeah, what's your little filter? Someone's not going to be better off by knowing you.

Jace Cosgrove:
No, I want to make sure people are better off for me coming into their life in whatever way it is. I mean obviously in my work life, it's all about money. I've got lots of clients. I want to make sure that I'm very authentic, okay? I've got some clients that are made, that are extremely wealthy. I'll say to them, "Mate, you're beyond me. Yes, I can advise you in relation to strategies and making sure you're doing the right thing, but in terms of wealth building, we need to flip the chart here. I want to take advice from you."

Jace Cosgrove:
I can help people get to a certain point, I'm not going to try and be somebody I'm not. The Your Wealth Your Way process is great for everything that I've just mentioned. Use the strategies. Make sure your super's in, all that sort of stuff. We start with you where you're at and improve the situation or the journey that you're going on. I had someone ask me a couple weeks ago. What's the biggest mistake people make? I'm like, you know what?

Robbie:
Great question.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah. I was like, you know what? People don't make mistakes. If you make a mistake, you've done something. If it's a mistake, it hasn't turned out in your favor, but at least you've learned. I remember Conan McGregor came from his fight that he lost a few years ago and someone said, "Oh, you lost." He goes, "Oh, you either win or you lose." I mean you win or you learn, you don't lose.

Tamara:
Yeah, you win or you learn.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, you don't lose. He said as long as you do, just do something. If it doesn't turn out in your favor, take the lesson from it and you know more next time you go out. So yeah, I just want to make sure that people are better off for me being a party of their life. If I can't help them to become better, then high five for you. You're already doing great. I'm not going to try and help you do something that I can't help you to be better at because you're doing a great job already yourself.

Tamara:
I guess when you say the biggest mistake they've made, but essentially the biggest mistake is not making anything, not doing anything.

Jace Cosgrove:
From my point of view, people don't make mistakes. They just don't know. They don't know all this stuff.

Robbie:
Making a mistake implies that you knew the right thing was to do in the first place.

Jace Cosgrove:
That's right.

Tamara:
You don't know what you don't know.

Jace Cosgrove:
You don't know what you don't know. This is the world I live in. I don't do my own electrical work. I need lights changed and things. I'm not going to have a crack at that myself.

Tamara:
Robbie is banned from that stuff.

Jace Cosgrove:
You know what I mean. That stuff you don't do because the effects of it are instant as in your burn your fucking house down. Whereas in my world, it's like I'll just go and use those super fund that my old boss used to use because that's all I've ever known. That might not be the best one for you. The whole point about this Your Wealth Your Way thing is it came from a place where we would have clients say referred from you in the past where they might use their super to go and buy property. They had money left over. We'd say we want to make sure that money is not just in the bank. It's either got to be offsetting the loan or it's going to to be invested appropriately. I'm sitting there going, this whole life around this person, their assets outside of super, liabilities, their cashflow, we're not even tapping into any of that stuff.

Jace Cosgrove:
That's the whole, I guess we come back to that all encompassing process that we do just to make sure.

Tamara:
What's the plan?

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, building that long term plan around everything that they're about.

Tamara:
There are so many different facets and different inputs and goals that every person is going to be different.

Jace Cosgrove:
100%.

Tamara:
One person's lifestyle or one person's family base or situation is so different from the next. It's not like this is the X number that you have to retire on.

Jace Cosgrove:
You know what? I've got clients that are that different that one guy is 62. He's got a couple million dollars in his [inaudible 00:38:58] deposits. He's totally risk adverse. I've got a client that's 90 and he's got a couple million dollars and he trades his money. Everyone is that different. The 62-year-old, "Mate, you need a little bit more exposure to the market. We need to be in some growth assets." He's like, "No, mate, term deposits for me." I'm like, "You're getting one point something percent." Whereas the 80 or 90 year old guy is like, "Mate, maybe you need to term now." No.

Robbie:
It really does come down to the person, right? I tell all of my clients. I'm an inherently lazy person. I want to find something that means I do as little work as I possibly can to get the greatest returns. For me, that's very different to someone who wants to be super hands on and be like I want to work for this. I want to be sitting there and I want to do the trades myself. I want to do this and that. It just does not interest me one little bit.

Jace Cosgrove:
At all, yeah.

Tamara:
If that's their passion, if that's what really drives them, then fucking go for it.

Jace Cosgrove:
Go for it, yeah as long as they know what they're doing. They can lose a lot of money, I guess.

Robbie:
We literally had a client give us an email yesterday. You know our strategy, right? Where an interest rate is worth 4-1/2, 5%-ish sort of thing which is what it's been like over the last couple of years. If you've got 40, 50, 60 grand left over after buying a property and the share market wasn't performing that well, it was quite static, a good spot for that money would be sitting in your offset account saving yourself 4-1/2, 5% on interest that you're paying. Therefore, making the cashflow of the property easier, paying down quicker if you're on P&I where it's going to be.

Robbie:
Of course now, it's so much reversed around. Interest rates are so low, low 3% from an investment and low 2% sometimes, one point something from a own home perspective, if you've got 40, 50 grand left over, you shouldn't have that be sitting in an offset account anymore. You should be just trying to put in a bloody for instance Colonial First State managed fund and have that be sitting in the market. What's the share market? Purely from our own perspective term what we dip 60 grand into the share market, you say July, August last year, and by December it had gone up to $70,000.

Robbie:
It's like a 13, 14% compound return on 60 grand in six months.

Tamara:
Rather than the 1% in that term deposit.

Robbie:
In the offset account.

Tamara:
Yeah.

Jace Cosgrove:
You mentioned that client. I had a client last night, one of your clients saving good money. They're saving $3,000 a month and they've got debts.

Robbie:
A lot of our clients are doing that.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah. They've got debts of about a million dollars. These guys are let's say 30 years to retirement. By allocating half of that $3,000, so we're still going to keep half in the offset account. We're going to put half into an investment. The difference was $600,000 over the 30 years. That's just one of the little ordinary done consistently produces extraordinary results.

Robbie:
That's the thing. When someone's like, "Oh, do you reckon I'm about the right time to go speak to Jace?" Well, the crystal ball that you always ask me, what should we do here? I'm like I don't fucking know, mate. The clarity that you're asking me from, us as coaches, can't wave a magic wand and go, this is what's going to occur for you. We're all about layman's terms interpretation of investment markets, supported by the key advisors to give you options to go do something.

Tamara:
We don't want to be financial planners. That's your job. The property asset is our specialty, but it might not be the right thing for everybody. That's your job is to look at different strategies and help people, guide people in what.

Robbie:
What I say to them as far as clarity perspective terms because a little adjunct, I'm like go have a chat with Jace. Go right now and go. That's the trajectory. Based on your current circumstances, you just do this. That's 9:00. If you want to change a few things, that $600,000 gap that we just spoke about based off the Your Wealth Your Way modeling program that you've got, that gives them the clarity. It then becomes a fucking no-brainer. Why wouldn't you do that?

Jace Cosgrove:
That 600 grand allows them to retire five years sooner on that $120,000 and they did nothing more than what they're currently doing other than direct half of their savings to a different vehicle.

Dan:
Different location.

Robbie:
Yeah, that would provide a clarity on an option that will give themselves a better outcome based on current trends and conditions and variables of the future. It's fucking gold, mate. I'm so happy that you've got that sort of software modeling program under way. Let's just talk about that quickly.

Robbie:
No one else has got that. Tell the story quickly about you and Mark and what you were trying to achieve as far as coming up with a spreadsheet which is underpinned by all those amazing values that gives you that model.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, mate, look. I mean I guess it comes back to what I was saying before where I felt like we were doing half a job. Where we'd say to people, "Make sure your super's invested properly." I feel like, and I keep my head in the sand in relation to other financial advisors. I'm not interested in what they're doing. I focus on my own backyard.

Tamara:
You're in that tallest building.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah. I'm like all right. If we're doing half a job, how can I justify charging people to do half a job when I know that there's more to be done? If I genuinely do want to be help people put them in a better position, I've got to fucking help them put them in a better position all the way. It just became how do we do this. It's evolving and evolving. We were having text message the other day. I was like, "Mate," you said I haven't got a client that's preaching. This is the process that we just went through. I'm like, "That's so great." I'm like you. I've heard you say this before. I never stop thinking about this. This was a Saturday. I had spent all Saturday literally all Saturday thinking about what about this? What about that?

Jace Cosgrove:
I go into work this morning. I quickly wanted to go to work because I was going to come here. I'm like, "No, I want to go work and talk to the guys." I've gone into work. "Guys, quick, board room right now. I've got 15 minutes." I'm like, "I need to change this. I need to do this. We need to make this better. That didn't work." It's always improving. It just built on. I thought it would take me a few months, mate. It's been like five years. Now I come to the realization if I'm going to continue on in this industry, I will never stop improving. I will never stop making this better.

Tamara:
It will never be perfect. With all of those things, projects, you have to just take the courage to jump. To get it going and I bet as soon as you launch that, and got it in the market, got people using it, then you start realizing, okay, we need to tweak this.

Jace Cosgrove:
Okay, so you've just reminded me of something else. This is one of the biggest things.

Tamara:
I love watching you.

Jace Cosgrove:
This is one of the biggest things that happen. I used to say to people, how much do you want to live off when you retire. They're like, "I don't know." Everyone, I have no idea.

Tamara:
Us included.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, there's this group called ASFA, the Association of Super Funds of Australia that suggests. This is a conversation I'm having with some friends of mine. $62,000 is a comfortable level of income for retirement. The wife looked at the husband and said, "You better work your fucking ass off, mate because there's no way I can live on $62,000 when we retire." I'd already in my mind done the numbers, right? These guys earn $130,000 between them. They had their own business, $65,000 each. Tax on thought is $25,000. So they're down to 105. They've got a home loan which they're paying $3,000 a month. That's 36. Let's say it's 35 to round it down to $70,000.

Jace Cosgrove:
They've got a car loan which is $1,000 a month. So they're down from 70 down to 58. They've got two kids that go to my kids' school. Say that's 10 grand a year plus. These guys are living on 40 grand. Once you take out the home loan, the car loan, the kids, all these expenses that they won't have in retirement, $62,000 is a fucking pay raise. You know what I mean? This is the clarity you want to give people. Sorry, mate, I'm spitting on you.

Robbie:
That's all right.

Jace Cosgrove:
This is the clarity we want to give people that we can. Let's not say how much. We need to get rid of the tax. Once you've structured yourself properly in retirement, you won't be paying tax. We want to make sure that you're retired in your own home debt free. You won't have a home loan. Hopefully the kids aren't going to be a financial burden on you as much as they are. You want to spoil them, but they're not going to cost you 15 grand a year.

Robbie:
The grandkids come into it then.

Jace Cosgrove:
The grandkids, mate. Let's get rid of all the expenses.

Tamara:
Then that's giving you choices though.

Robbie:
That's right. I was just about to say that.

Tamara:
You're setting yourself up to have choices. Sure, you don't have your home loan. You don't have your car loan. You don't have the kids at shool. Go off and travel and go off and do the holidays that you wanted to do and go travel Australia. Be those brave nomads, whatever you want to do. You do that in a level of comfortability that you want, that you decide and those opportunities and experiences and if you want to be able to gift your grandchildren or be able to put your grandchildren through a nice shool, then you've got those opportunities.

Jace Cosgrove:
You've got the ability to do so, yeah. Absolutely. We talk to our clients and say, "What is it that you do?" Mate, I just give people the clarity of what the future looks like and the knowledge to know they're doing all the right things, all the way along the way. That's in a nutshell what we do.

Tamara:
Nice.

Robbie:
Same here really.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah. That's why we get on so well. We even finish each other's sentences.

Robbie:
Again, I was listening to Gary Vaynerchuk talking about the building thing is he went to a series of old folks homes in the US recently and he was like literally looking into the souls of people fucking waiting to die and go and say hi to the big guy. He said the number one thing he could see in every single person's eyes there was regret. Regret they hadn't done this and regret they hadn't been smarter with their money or regret they didn't have the choices. The fucking list of all the shit of the things we want to be able to do in life.

Robbie:
He's like now I'm talking to a bunch of 25 year olds. Do not fucking be like that. I'm now putting you on notice that you're going to fucking be at that stage. Certainly when we went to your beautiful grandmother's 80th birthday over the Christmas period just gone, that was the first time I'd been around 65, 75, 85 year olds as well. It gave me a real fucking kick up the bum. I'm like, "You're only 50, mother fucker. Get your shit in order because that's going to be on your doorstep real fucking quick."

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah.

Tamara:
I think that was just before you started the 75 Hard.

Jace Cosgrove:
It was.

Tamara:
Going back to that again. That was such a driver for you going what is going on with my health? What is going on with my lifestyle that I'm doing to better now?

Jace Cosgrove:
So good.

Robbie:
Mate, what a huge contribution, I think, Jace. I can go out and say that you've made to all of our lives both from a physical perspective, but also providing that holistic framework when it comes to our finances, mate. I know there's loads of our clients that owe you a huge debt of gratitude as well when you've taken them through that process, mate. A quick shout out and a quick thank you for that. Also, I think it's almost guaranteed you're coming back again for another podcast episode.

Jace Cosgrove:
Yeah, there's heaps more stuff.

Tamara:
We need to do a bonus one for tax time.

Robbie:
Yeah.

Jace Cosgrove:
Let's do it, yeah.

Robbie:
As the market evolves and as the changing circumstances and moving money into different markets for different purposes, why wouldn't we want to keep everyone informed as far as that goes? Ladies and gents, if you've had an opportunity to be really wowed by what Jace has gone through today, leave some comments. Give us a blood awesome review. But please do yourself a favor in the [inaudible 00:49:34] and do the righty. Pass this on to anyone else that you know.

Jace Cosgrove:
Absolutely.

Robbie:
Mate, thanks for joining us.

Jace Cosgrove:
My pleasure, you guys [crosstalk 00:49:39].

Dan:
Thanks, Jace.

Jace Cosgrove:
See you, mate.

Dan:
See you guys, bye.

Tamara:
Bye.

Robbie:
Hey, thanks for tuning into today's podcast. If you enjoyed listening, make sure you give us a five star rating. Hit subscribe so you'll be first in line to get it in your inbox every week on a Tuesday. Whilst you're at it, open up your favorite social media app. Be that Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn and YouTube and connect with Axon Property Group. This is where you'll see us every day sharing the secrets of creating multimillion dollar property portfolios and performing to the highest levels of your life. You'll get exclusive behind-the-scenes access to what it really takes to build a life that you love. You'll also discover how to secure your financial future as an ADF member or veteran and I assure your future self will love you for it.

Robbie:
Thanks again for listening, and that's a wrap.

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